Why does ice float on water?

Ice is water right? It's just that it's solid. So why does it float in liquid water? And also why does water expand when it freezes, when typically things contract when they freeze? These are things we are used to observing daily, but they actually are a little strange, and we bet the answer will surprise you.
Melissa:

Hey. I'm Melissa.

Jam:

I'm Jam.

Melissa:

And I'm a chemist.

Jam:

And I'm not.

Melissa:

And welcome to chemistry for your life.

Jam:

The podcast helps you understand the chemistry of your everyday

Melissa:

life. For some reason, I expected you to say bonus edition even though this is just a regular old edition.

Jam:

Yeah. False alarm.

Melissa:

I think it's been we're recording. I think we've mentioned a few times. We're recording significantly ahead Yeah. Because Jam is Preparing for paternity leave, and I'm preparing for vacation

Jam:

Yeah.

Melissa:

To reward myself for getting a PhD. Yeah.

Melissa:

So pretty big, Long term vacation, like, several weeks of being out of town?

Jam:

We could probably come up with some term for something like something leave. Maternity leave, paternity leave, PhD at tea leave.

Melissa:

Doctor tea leave? Yeah. Yeah. It is kind of like I had a baby. Now it's the easier part.

Melissa:

Like, the baby just turned 5 or something.

Jam:

Where it's kinda the other way around with yeah. It's like you're building up to the hardest Periods of

Melissa:

time. Yeah. Yeah. When you when you're about to have the baby. Yeah.

Melissa:

Like, everything hard. Take taken my doctorate leave during the 2 months where I

Melissa:

was writing that dissertation. Yeah. That's when I needed my paternity leave for my dissertation.

Melissa:

Yeah. Anyway, all that to say that we're way ahead, and I don't know what's happening right now. But I'm happy to be here today because we're gonna be talking about something that's in response to a listener question.

Jam:

Nice.

Melissa:

This is from listener Wendy. And Wendy asked well, actually, Wendy asked Just a specific question that I broadened out.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

So Wendy's question was why does water expand when it freezes while many other things Condense as they freeze.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

So that's a good question, but I actually think a more everyday life question is then why does Ice float on

Jam:

water. Okay.

Melissa:

So we kind of touched on this a little bit when we did the snowflake episode.

Jam:

Oh, yeah.

Melissa:

And we talked about the reason snowflake has their specific shape.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

But I don't know if we talked about how that The implications of that for, water is a solid versus water is a liquid and literally water floating.

Jam:

Right. Right. And it's been, like, of of course, a ton of episodes that have Gone into some differences of

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

Liquids and gases and solids and stuff. It's always been a principle, but it hasn't be been the main thing of an episode in this way, guess.

Melissa:

Right. Exactly. And I think that what is good about this topic is ice floating in water is very everyday, But also some other experiences that I think many of us have had are pretty everyday. Like, were did you have the thing when you were a kid And you figured out you could freeze water to have really cold water during the summer because it was so hot in Texas?

Jam:

And then

Melissa:

you got over ambitious, And you froze a whole water bottle full and it exploded? Yes. You had this experience? Uh-huh.

Jam:

Memorable for me is when I tried to do that with a soda. Yeah. And it you know?

Melissa:

Oh. Yep. Yeah.

Jam:

Constant mess in the freezer.

Melissa:

Yes. Definitely. And that is because Water expands when it freezes, but that is not intuitive to us, I don't think. Yeah. Especially as children because Other things don't expand as they freeze for the most part.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

There are only a few substances that expand as they freeze, and water is one of them.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

So and there are some cool implications for this in everyday life that I'm gonna talk about at some fun facts at the end. But right now, I wanna talk about why this happens.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

And I also think this is a fun kind of a philosophical question because Galileo Actually, had a public debate. There's a chemistry and engineering news article about this. He had a public debate back in the day About how can ice flow in water when ice itself is water. So this is Truly an age old question

Jam:

that we're

Melissa:

doing. And it's cool because they didn't have the answer then, but we do have the answer now. Isn't that weird?

Jam:

Yeah. That is crazy.

Melissa:

K. So the reason that it can float is literally just because it expands as it freezes. But that phenomenon is the weird part. That's what we're gonna actually focus in on is, I guess, you have your answer to the the first part. If you just wanna know why it floats, it's because It expands.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

But now I'm gonna tell you all about why it expands.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

And also sort of why other things don't. Okay. So let's just talk about what happens to molecules in different phases of water. Okay. And we've talked about this a lot before, but it's definitely always valuable to revisit, and it's also valuable as a student of chemistry for you to have in your mind.

Melissa:

The idea of what's going on at the molecular level, we've talked about this before, but this idea of understanding different representations of molecules It is an important part of understanding chemistry. Right? So

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

In the chemistry education world, we call this representational competence. Are you competent in understanding different representations of a molecule. K. And you actually got I got so excited when we did the episode about why your tires go flat in the winter Because you had you demonstrated this ability to understand what was going on on the molecular level. You knew that there were molecules in the tire.

Melissa:

You knew that we put energy in and that molecules spread out, and that must put more pressure on the container. And I was like, oh my gosh. You got it. I was so excited. And so that's something I wanna build into our listeners' minds as well.

Melissa:

So that's why I always take time to revisit what's going on at the molecular level.

Jam:

Right. Right. Because at least, like, things we learn about the mother level can be applied to other things too

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

In all kinds of different situations.

Melissa:

Exactly.

Jam:

Yeah. Makes sense.

Melissa:

Use this to understand what's happening at the molecular level in everyday life, not just in this one situation.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

So now imagine if you will, I'm gonna use a analogy. I'm gonna steal your your job from you yet again this week. Sorry. I've been doing this a lot lately.

Jam:

It's okay.

Melissa:

Thanks for forgiving me. So

Jam:

I mean, in some ways, I think It's good because, 1, like I said before, helps me understand it better the 1st time.

Melissa:

Mhmm.

Jam:

Which is good for me, good for you, good for all listeners. Also, there are some times where the quick turnaround of come up with an analogy in the moment Yeah. Is hard. And sometimes, especially these days, as in we're recording a lot and fitting a lot in, preparing stuff like that, my brain and right now, we're recording in the late in the evening. The brain, not always at its

Melissa:

Not a 100%.

Jam:

Sharpest. So it could be that would come up with some really weird off the wall, not helpful, Really dumb analogy, and you are saving me that embarrassment. So for that, thank you.

Melissa:

Okay. Well so what I liked as an analogy for this part is actually A concert hall of some kind. So Okay. Imagine, like, a band playing a concert. I've been into T Swift and Lizzo Lele.

Melissa:

So imagine, You know, someone on the stage who's really popular, and there are so many people there to see this show that they are jam packed in this concert space.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

There's standing room only, literally. There's not a dance Floor. There's not a mosh pit. Mhmm. Literally packed in shoulder to shoulder as close as people can possibly get.

Jam:

Okay. Got it.

Melissa:

Okay. So and the thing that's holding the atoms together when they're this jam packed together, well, really always are intermolecular forces.

Jam:

Right. No.

Melissa:

Actually, let me say that again. Now in molecules, the things that are holding the molecules together, like if you have a bunch of water molecules or Maybe a better example for this one would be something that gets smaller when it freezes, so a different type of molecule. The thing that's holding them together is intermolecular forces.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

So that's your typical solid is the molecules or the atoms depending on what kind of substance you're looking at are so closely jam packed together that they aren't able to move very much.

Jam:

K.

Melissa:

They can maybe they have wiggle room, you know, the molecules themselves are vibrating, shifting, whatever, but they're not walking around the concert hall. There's not a Lot of movement happening. There's, like, slight movement within the individual molecules, but that's kind of it. They're sort of locked in.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

And oftentimes, there's a strongly repeating pattern called a crystal structure. Not always, but the more well find that repeating pattern is, the more highly crystallized the substance looks. So that's why sometimes you get really beautiful solids or you get really beautiful cubes of solids.

Jam:

Right. Right.

Melissa:

So, typically, solids are packed in really tight. There's not a lot of room for movement. Your intermolecular forces are there's not enough energy to overcome the intermolecular forces to get the solid to spread out, the molecules inside the solid to spread out, And this is the solid state. Now if you imagine having the same number of people in that same space, And you just make the room there in bigger Uh-huh. And you give them more room to spread out, The that's more how liquid moves.

Melissa:

You'd have to put energy into the molecules to let them spread out Right. Or relieve the pressure either way.

Jam:

Yeah.

Melissa:

But Taking away that pressure, putting energy in, maybe give give them some, food, some drinks, get them excited, let them spread out a little. Uh-huh. Let them dance. Let them, you know, move around the dance floor. We got room now.

Melissa:

They're not just packed in. They get to enjoy the show a little bit more. That's kind of how A water molecular structure is. Where there it's still 1 group of molecules. They're still bound together through these intermolecular forces.

Melissa:

But the intermolecular forces, there's enough energy in them that the intermolecular forces are starting to be overcome. The molecules can spread out a little bit more. They're not as jam packed in closely together. So this is the equivalent of humans moving around the dance they're individually moving, but they're also moving around within the room. Mhmm.

Melissa:

There's just a lot more movement happening, and that's why typically The same number of molecules in a liquid takes up more space than this that equivalent number of molecules in a solid.

Jam:

K. Got it.

Melissa:

So if you have 2 of the same number of things that weigh the same things and one takes up more space than the other, That thing is less dense. There's less weight per unit.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

And so, usually, that thing will be the thing that floats.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

So, typically, if I have a liquid and I drop in the frozen version of that. Mhmm. The frozen version will sink because the molecules are packed so closely together that it's more dense.

Jam:

Got it. Okay.

Melissa:

And then

Jam:

like, would that be what would be a good example, like a metal or something like that? Like

Melissa:

Yeah. It's hard to come up with a good example because For most things, as soon as you start to drop that thing in the liquid version, then the molecules are going to start to get energy put into them, and they'll start to melt. So It's hard for me to just be able to visualize off the top of my head of time where I've dropped a frozen thing

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

Into something else and it sank. Hang on. Let me think. And you listeners at home also take a minute and see if you can come up with a solid that sinks in the liquid version of itself. And I'll think of it too and see what we can come up with because for some reason, it's not just coming straight to my mind.

Jam:

Yeah.

Melissa:

Okay. So we are sitting here trying to think of something, And my husband happens to be hanging out listening to us record. He doesn't have anything better to do on a Thursday night. And so It's kind of like he gets a live podcast. That's kinda fun.

Melissa:

Yeah. Maybe we should do a live podcast for others. Mhmm. And he came up with This one that's really good, which is butter. When you melt butter, the liquid seems to sort of float up around the solid.

Melissa:

The solid Stays at the bottom. Yeah. Now I wanna go melt some butter and drop some other butter in it and see if that really holds up, but I

Melissa:

think that is a good Representation.

Jam:

Which might be true about other oils and that kind of stuff too. Yes. But, yeah, the butter's the one that I think most people would have interacted with.

Melissa:

Yes. And that's the thing About this concept that's kind of weird is I think as nonscientists are like, oh, yeah. Water expands, so other things must expand, but other things don't expand. Yeah. As they freeze.

Melissa:

Water's kind of the only one.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

Okay. So back to the analogy. We've got our Our solid stage where everyone is really packed in, and then if you can increase the volume, put a little bit more energy, and take away some of that pressure, People can move around a little bit more, and that's equivalent to the liquid state. And then the gaseous state, I really like this, is when everybody just goes Tom. They all spread out.

Melissa:

They go wherever they want. There's tons of space in between everyone. They just leave, And you put energy into the car to get there, so it's even more energy. So there is effort in overcoming those intermolecular forces, but we're just spreading out, going everywhere we want. Boom.

Melissa:

That's the end.

Jam:

Yes. Yes.

Melissa:

So that's the gaseous stage.

Jam:

Anywhere they can go, they do they do go.

Melissa:

Yes. Okay. Exactly.

Jam:

Anywhere a gas molecule can go, it Will go. It will

Melissa:

It will go.

Jam:

Then will spread it.

Melissa:

It tries to get out. Yes. So here's what's different about water. Okay. It sort of follows that same structure in that the solid state is pretty fixed, and it doesn't have A lot of energy for the molecules to be moving around freely, which is why it's solid and not liquid.

Melissa:

Right?

Jam:

Right. And it is at a lower temperature?

Melissa:

It's at a lower temperature. It doesn't have the energy in for those molecules to move around, and it makes a crystalline structure, but it just so happens that that solid isn't as packed in as tight as you might Think. So my analogy for this that I was really proud of

Jam:

Uh-huh.

Melissa:

Is if you had that same dance floor, but instead of letting people move around in it, You put a bunch of chairs in.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

So if there were seats and say the seats are all maybe, like Have 1 fair square foot of space around them or 3 square feet of space around them or something or subspace between them. Uh-huh. And everyone gets to sit in their seat. So, again, they're in their seat. They're not able to stand up and move around a lot.

Melissa:

They're fixed in their position, But it's taking up way more space than if they were jam packed together.

Jam:

Got it. They're still they've become still.

Melissa:

They're still. They're stuck in their seat.

Jam:

But they aren't packed in as tightly as they would be?

Melissa:

If they were all standing up.

Jam:

Right. Right. Okay.

Melissa:

So if they're all standing up shoulder to shoulder packed in super tight, then that would be normal solids. Yes. But ice solids, they're still kind of Stuck where they're at. They're still in a crystal structure, but they have a lot of empty space around them. They're not using their space well.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

Interesting. Like chairs.

Jam:

Got it.

Melissa:

In a concert hall.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

You can literally fit less people in a concert hall if they have to sit down instead of stand because they need more

Jam:

Right. Right. Like in, like, like, in, like, a theater

Melissa:

Yep.

Jam:

Yeah, versus going to a standing room only place like this. Okay. Yeah. Makes sense.

Melissa:

Exactly. And that's kind of what happens with water is they are very structured just like other solids. It's very orderly in fact. Mhmm. And the molecules are held tightly together, but they're held in this arrangement where there's physically empty space between the molecules because of the way they're arranged just like chairs.

Jam:

Okay. Interesting.

Melissa:

Okay. So let's talk about what water molecules look like.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

Okay. So the best way I could think of to describe a water molecule is actually that it It looks like Mickey Mouse heads. Okay. So there's 1 big atom, the oxygen, and 2 small atoms, the Oxygen in 2 small atoms, the hydrogens.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

There's also some lone pairs on the oxygen, which push the 2 hydrogens close together closer together than they would. Okay. So that's why they're kind of at the top of the Mickey Mouse head.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

And then the the Extra electrons are almost like where his shoulders would be.

Jam:

Okay.

Melissa:

So you've got this Mickey Mouse head. And because of the nature of the way that the molecules are bonded together, water is polar. And if you wanna learn more about Polarity go all the way back to our very first episode, which is how soap works.

Jam:

Right. Right.

Melissa:

And we go in-depth about The difference between a polar bond, a polar molecule, and what that means. But essentially, it means that there's positive Charges permanently on one side of the molecule and negative charges permanently on the other.

Jam:

Mhmm.

Melissa:

And in the case of this Water molecule, this Mickey Mouse head, the ears are the hydrogens, and those are positive. Uh-huh. And then the negative charge is concentrated at the Bottom of his head, sort of the bottom of the round part near where a chin would

Jam:

be. Yes.

Melissa:

So when these molecules are forming liquids, they can come near each other, fit in, go away, come together, come apart, and they can actually get Pretty close together. Uh-huh. Because they're able to then repel each other with their positive, negative charge, you know, whatever.

Jam:

Yeah.

Melissa:

But when they're fixed in place, they want to optimize the positive charge being lined up with the negative charge.

Jam:

Right. Okay.

Melissa:

So what happens is you'll have a Mickey Mouse head with 2 positive ears, and that lines up next to a Mickey Mouse neck where the negative part is.

Jam:

Got it.

Melissa:

And then you've got another positive part Lining up, pointing outwards from that same one. So that lines up to the negative part of another one. So the way that they fit in actually is shaped Actually, like a honeycomb kind of Ah. Where they make these little hexagons with 6 corners because that is the best Way for them to pack in close together and line up the ears with the bottom, the ears with bottom, the positive with the negative, positive with negative. Yeah.

Melissa:

But it ends up like a honeycomb leaving a lot of empty space.

Jam:

Got it. Okay.

Melissa:

So when I visualize the molecular structure of water Frozen, I visualize it as a honeycomb actually with Our water molecules lined up in a hexagon pattern, and we briefly talked about this on our episode also about snowflakes.

Jam:

Right. Right.

Melissa:

But because it lines up like that, there's a lot more empty space in the solid of water because it has this weird Mickey Mouse shape with a a permanent polarity in it. And so the way the intermolecular forces bring them together when they're going to be stuck there permanently. They try to optimize the way that they're stuck on, and so they take up more space than they normally would.

Jam:

Got it.

Melissa:

Interesting. I thought of it sort of like if you have a bunch of old people who are tired and they can't really handle standing at a concert For 3 hours, that's when we put chairs in.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

Because you have to optimize their experience in the concert, or else they won't

Jam:

Yeah. Or some, like, concert have been to just the vibe of whatever artist or it is, band, whatever. They're just the places they go. They go to theaters. Right.

Jam:

They go they do shows where people ever has an assigned seat.

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

They don't do standing up.

Melissa:

Exactly.

Jam:

And then it's like, sorry. There's no other no other way for this to work.

Melissa:

Is how it has to

Jam:

happen. This is how it happened. There is gonna be lots of space between you.

Melissa:

Yes. Yeah. But in water molecules, because When it's in the liquid form, they can move around more. They don't have to be stuck in that. They're, like, moving close together, coming apart, moving together, close apart.

Melissa:

They have all this energy to move around. They don't mind coming together in the least optimal pattern because it's so short lived.

Jam:

Right. Right.

Melissa:

But when it's solid, they're Fixed in place, so you really have to optimize what's happening.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

So it's like it doesn't super make sense For a dance floor to have chairs on it. Right? So Yeah. When it's in its liquid state and everyone's moving around, great. But if you're going to be sitting and watching a very chill concert For 4 hours, it makes the most sense for there to be chairs.

Jam:

Right. Right.

Melissa:

And that's what's going on with water.

Jam:

Okay. Interesting.

Melissa:

So because then that same number of molecules has to line up in this exact same way, there's a lot of empty space. If you have A 100 liquid water molecules and a 100 solid water molecules. The solid water molecules are physically going to take up more space even though they weigh the same amount.

Jam:

Yes.

Melissa:

And so that means because they're taking up more space, they have less weight per volume, Which means they'll float on top of water.

Jam:

Right. They are packed together less densely. Yep. But even in the same amount of molecules, there There's more effects between them, so they are going to float

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

Above their liquid counterpart.

Melissa:

They're packed together less Densely, but in a way that is more energetically favorable because the positives and negatives are lined up.

Jam:

Got it. Got it.

Melissa:

And there's usually a pretty good visualization of this in textbooks where it has the it just has, like, squares of the same space, and it has, like, a few gas molecules, and you can tell that they're moving. And Uh-huh. You know, there's, like, dash lines around them so you can Get the vibe that they're running around crazily. Uh-huh. And then there's the liquid water one where the molecules there's a lot more, and they're moving around, and they're kind of haphazardly placed.

Melissa:

And then you get the solid water molecules where they are very clearly ordered, but also they less of them fit in that picture.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

So maybe I can post that on our Instagram or something. Yeah.

Jam:

That'd be cool. And then also, even maybe a Drawing of the hexagon thing or whatever.

Melissa:

Oh, yeah. Yeah. My cool They do show it. They show the honeycomb structure. Yeah.

Melissa:

When they show the water molecule structure, they usually will depict it in that honeycomb structure because so you can kind of see the Mickey Mouse heads lining up.

Jam:

Got it. Dude, cool. Interesting.

Melissa:

I think it's so interesting. I really do think that What's crazy is if you start to think about how the world would be different if water didn't float when it froze. But but let's save that.

Jam:

Yeah.

Melissa:

That's a little treat waiting for us at the end of you teaching it back to me.

Jam:

Okay. Cool. So I think I have an analogy for this.

Melissa:

Is it gonna be better than my analogy or worse? Or worse? Just kidding.

Jam:

Well, what's the decision to decide? So imagine you have a concert hall. What if I, like, really straight Straight face just totally did the exact analogy.

Melissa:

Because I could see how excited you were to make that joke leading into you saying it, so I that you were about to say something totally

Jam:

Yeah. Sometimes I'm better at hiding it, but I just I thought about it too long. What helps to keep a straight face if you is if you just think about it right before you say it. If you give yourself any amount of time, that's when it's hard

Melissa:

not to to be funnier and funnier

Jam:

Not exactly what Melissa just said. That was

Melissa:

so funny. A friend. You actually know him probably Brandon. Uh-huh. He would Say these he would make an inside joke and never even look at the person he told the he was, like, making the joke with.

Melissa:

Uh-huh.

Melissa:

Like, he would make an aside as if it was nothing, and he would just, like, out of the corner of his eye, like, see their reaction.

Jam:

But it

Melissa:

was like, you never Nobody else really knew what was going on. Nice.

Jam:

Nice to see. Subtle.

Melissa:

Yeah. I love that.

Melissa:

Do you have an actual analogy, or were you just only doing it for the joke?

Jam:

No. I don't. I just wanna make that joke, because, honestly, like, I think some things that were going through my mind a little bit were Just similar enough. Like, they didn't actually change the dimension. I was thinking about other things that basically were people people in a space and What things changes the density of the people.

Jam:

Like, how closely they're packed together or not. And so, yeah, I don't have a huge difference. But so let me just explain it back in my own words.

Melissa:

Okay. I think that will help anyway.

Jam:

Yeah. It'll help me make sure I I'm not missing something. So, Typically, with a solid starting there, it's molecules packed in tightly together

Melissa:

Mhmm.

Jam:

With not much room or energy to be able to move around.

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

And they are held together also by molecular forces intermolecular forces.

Melissa:

Intermolecular forces. Yeah. Mhmm. That's what holds everything together.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

Except the individual molecules bonds aren't in the molecular forces.

Jam:

And that would be using the immunology you used. That would be like a very densely packed may use that one on purpose. Densely packed

Melissa:

Mhmm.

Jam:

Concert hall where it's standing only. Everyone is shoulder to shoulder, chest to back, very tightly packed in.

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

Cannot move around.

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

The room is the size it is, and there's it's it is a fixed size.

Melissa:

Yep.

Jam:

And they cannot move.

Melissa:

It's probably a fire hazard to have that many people in there.

Jam:

It truly is. Honestly, this hypothetical concert hall is asking for is asked to happen. So Then pretend that you drop you're able to suddenly expand the walls. Make the space bigger, And people can start

Melissa:

You push back one of those dividers in the room.

Jam:

Exactly. Yep. A divider in the room or whatever it is. And The people could start moving around a little bit

Melissa:

Mhmm.

Jam:

Dancing. They got a little bit of freedom.

Melissa:

Mhmm.

Jam:

And they have a little bit more Space to do that Yes. As well. But it's the same number of people

Melissa:

Mhmm.

Jam:

Which is why typically, A liquid would be less dense

Melissa:

Mhmm.

Jam:

In the solid version of itself.

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

Same number of people centered molecules.

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

More room to move around so they are, less densely packed together.

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

Which means they float, and the solid sinks.

Melissa:

Yes. Like, if you had an ice cube that didn't expand and instead Contracted like most things do when they freeze, and you drop that in your water, boom, sinks straight to the bottom.

Jam:

Straight to the bottom.

Melissa:

Like other things do when you put them in water.

Jam:

Yes. But weirdly, water, instead of being like the concert hall that's packed shoulder to shoulder standing room only Mhmm. When it becomes solid, it's like Everyone gets a chair. Yep. And when everyone gets a chair, everyone takes up more room.

Melissa:

Yep.

Jam:

And that means you need more space. And so water everywhere gets a chair, they all sit down, And then so the same number of people

Melissa:

Mhmm.

Jam:

Are actually taking up more space than they were a moment ago?

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

And so it's expanded, and it be has become less dense.

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

And then it floats above the liquid version of itself

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

Blowing the minds of whoever was Aristotle or Galileo. Whatever. Who'd you say?

Melissa:

Galileo, I think.

Jam:

I don't know why I said Aristotle. I was do whatever.

Melissa:

They had a public debate about it. That was what people used to do for fun. And, also, that's kind of what you all are still doing for fun, listeners of chemistry for your life.

Jam:

True. And not much has changed.

Melissa:

No. That's true. And that that article is all about that there's still so much about water we don't understand.

Jam:

So that is why water, the celebration of water, which we No. It's ice. Affectionately, we call it ice. It floats.

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

It's taking up more space as a solid.

Melissa:

Yes. The same number of molecules take up more space as a solid, meaning it's less dense.

Jam:

I guess I should say the reason why is because Water is polar, which we talked about.

Melissa:

Yes. Yeah.

Jam:

And the when it's in solid form, it wants to orient itself where The positive end of 1 water molecule is near the negative end of the other water molecule Yes. Which means they can't just fit in really tightly.

Melissa:

Yes. And it is, like, each Mickey Mouse ear gets its own new oxygen that it's attached to. So imagine, like, Start with 1 Mickey Mouse ear or 1 Mickey Mouse head, and each Mickey Mouse ear has the bottom of another Mickey Mouse head. And each of those have 2 Mickey Mouse Heads on top of their ears.

Jam:

Yeah. So there's always gonna be this void in between Yep. Where this is this room where nothing's there.

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

And we call that void, and chemistry call that void, The eternal abyss.

Melissa:

No. It's empty space. Yeah.

Jam:

Or empty space. Whatever yeah. Different different strokes, different parts.

Melissa:

The eternal abyss.

Jam:

It's so good.

Melissa:

Recording this late at night, and I definitely have

Melissa:

a sleepy time, sillies.

Melissa:

That's why I'm laughing at Jam's joke's more than usual.

Jam:

Yes. More than usual. I'll take it. And so and that's why. The the polarity of water is is a huge factor in this.

Jam:

It's not just, Well, happens for water. Who knows why?

Melissa:

Yes. That's a good point. I'm glad you pointed that out. Yeah.

Jam:

And that's did I miss anything?

Melissa:

No. I think you got it. I think that's a really good explanation. And, actually, I feel like I was able to explain the Mickey Mouse head arrangement a little bit better this time than I was the 1st around. So that helped me too.

Melissa:

Your explanation also helped me think about how to talk about it. So that was really good. Awesome. Part of what I like about this analogy is usually what we talk about when we talk about molecules he's going from the solid to the liquid to the gas phase is putting more energy in them. Right.

Melissa:

And that's definitely a way to melt a solid, turn it into a liquid, and then turn the liquid into a gas. But what we haven't talked about is a relationship that pressure also plays in that. So you can actually turn a liquid into a solid by applying very high pressure because it forces the molecules Closer together.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

And then relieving the pressure will let the solid go back to the liquid.

Jam:

Right. Right. Okay.

Melissa:

And that is something that plays out in our everyday life in how water is different. Because if you can imagine the ocean

Jam:

Mhmm.

Melissa:

The bottom of the ocean is under so much pressure. And if it was under all that pressure and the solid was The solid state was the molecules being really close together. The bottom of the ocean would probably always be frozen from this Increase of refrigeration.

Jam:

Dude, that's crazy to think about. But because water doesn't work that way, it's the other way around.

Melissa:

Because The water molecules can be closer in their liquid state than they even can in their solid state. Yeah. It stays in the liquid state at the bottom of the ocean.

Jam:

And icebergs float to the top.

Melissa:

Icebergs float to the top. All ice in Lakes, when they freeze over in the winter, rivers and stuff is at the top. So that also is beneficial because underneath that, the aquatic life forms can still exists.

Jam:

Right. Right.

Melissa:

Ice fishing can still happen because ice floats.

Jam:

Mhmm. And

Melissa:

there's still bodies of water underneath Where fish and other aquatic life is, it's not frozen down there.

Jam:

Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. It's weird to think about that. Another thing another situation's the pressure works that way.

Jam:

We're all used to water. So, like Right. It's with the most one of the most common things that most of us interact with every day.

Melissa:

Yes.

Jam:

And it's interesting to think that it's an exception to these rules that do apply to so many other elements.

Melissa:

Mhmm.

Jam:

And it seems so odd to think, like, water under a lot of pressure, if it was something else, would be become a solid. Yeah. Because it's like, well, water doesn't, and we know that. So it seems like that's the rule. Like, no.

Jam:

No. No. Actually, water's kind of the one that's breaking these rules here. Yeah. But it just also happens to be the most, like, common thing

Melissa:

That we're used to. Yeah. Yeah. So sometimes I'll catch myself worrying that Other things will expand when I phrase them, and then I remember, wait. No.

Melissa:

That's just water. You know, I catch myself kind of, Like, oh, is this gonna take up more space? And then I think, wait. That doesn't make sense. Yeah.

Melissa:

So I did actually even just Google, what if ice was more dense than water, and it was pretty a pretty fun thought experiment just to imagine how it might impact the world. One thing they talked about is how much The water on Earth regulates the heat because it has a high heat capacity and specific heat, which we talked about in the sand and water episode

Jam:

Mhmm.

Melissa:

Which we just rebroadcast. So there's there's so many tiny implications of this Mhmm. That are really fascinating. So I encourage you to just spend some time thinking about all the ways that ice and water Acting differently under pressure, acting differently when they freeze might be a positive impact on the world. And then just Google it and see what other things other people came up

Jam:

With? Yeah.

Melissa:

It's pretty fun.

Jam:

Interesting.

Melissa:

Well, speaking of fun things, do you wanna wrap up our Episode this week was something fun that you've been doing recently. I have a good one I'm very excited about.

Jam:

Yes. So last week, Em and I were able to Take our son and go out of town for a few days.

Melissa:

Oh.

Jam:

And some of my family members, they have a lake house they let us use, and just got to have, like, a little bit of just, like, quality family time. Some people call this, like, a babymoon Mhmm. Ideal, but whatever. Just like a oh, we're this is, like, our last time to do this, just us 3. You know?

Jam:

And so we did that. It just had a

Melissa:

cute. Just us 3.

Jam:

Just us 3. Just had a really chill four and a half days out at this Lakehouse, you gotta hang out, eat good food, not have a lot going on. Yeah. Get some quiet time together. A sort of calm before all the changes of adding another kid to the mix.

Jam:

So we did that, and it was really relaxing. It was really fun. Really chill.

Melissa:

Yeah. While you're talking, I was thinking how weird it is that your son right now kind of has no idea what's about to happen.

Jam:

No idea.

Melissa:

And also, That it will never just be you 3 when your new son is here until your 1st son goes off to college.

Jam:

Yep.

Melissa:

And the just the different life experiences of a 1st versus a second child.

Jam:

Yeah. It was actually the first time I really Took time to think about what that change will be like. That there is you're gaining something, but you're also losing something. That's just how it works. Yeah.

Jam:

But I just hadn't thought about that. Mhmm. I hadn't taken time to just think about there was this period of time, Only this little period where there's only 1 kid Yeah. And 2 adults. And the next time it happens, it will be when the last kid is left Yeah.

Jam:

But it's fully grown and fully an adult and not I mean, about to be leaving or whatever. And it won't be anything the same. You know? It it won't be

Melissa:

And also how much the 1st child didn't ask for that. Yeah. And how much the 2nd child is sort of being built, Born into a world that was built by the 1st child. The 1st child's preferences, and they got to do kind of what they wanted because they were the only kid. Yeah.

Melissa:

And so both parties didn't agree to that, but they just get shoved into it. They couldn't even agree to it because they're so young. Yeah. You know? Yeah.

Melissa:

So life just sort of happens to them.

Jam:

Yeah. And that's why we decided a long time ago, Em and I, that we're not doing a democracy. I don't know what exactly you'd call it, but it's it's mostly, I think, a monarchy probably. And so that that works best for us. We make those decisions, and they just have to, you know

Melissa:

It's just interesting to think about it. About how much of your life is shaped by these things that

Melissa:

you have so little control over? Yeah. Yeah. You know, like,

Melissa:

your first one will always Be shaped by

Melissa:

the fact that he was an older brother.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

And your 2nd kid will always be shaped by having that older Brother in his life and being born into your family after he was there.

Melissa:

Yeah. You know? It's just interesting. Yeah. Interesting to think about.

Jam:

And it's hard to give any, like, know, blanket statements for this stuff. But from my own experience, I think I was improved by the fact that I had 2 brothers. I mean, I had an older and younger. I kinda have both experiences of that, and I have come to the opinion that it was best for me. It was good.

Jam:

I learned a lot of good stuff. So

Melissa:

Like most things in life, It might be easier and see more fun in the moment for you to get to do whatever you want all the time. Yeah. Having a sibling really does is can be more challenging, but I also think it gives you a lot of good life skills. Yeah. It's just interesting to think about it from the perspective of, You know, a kid.

Jam:

Yeah. Totally. Yeah.

Melissa:

It's so weird because then they're just gonna be a new baby, and you didn't want that or ask for it. Yeah. And And now all of a sudden, there's a baby that lives in your house with you. Yeah. Yeah.

Melissa:

It's just funny to think about it like that.

Melissa:

Yeah. Interesting.

Jam:

That's what's gonna happen with me. What about you?

Melissa:

Well, mine's not that cute, but it is also about family.

Jam:

Nice.

Melissa:

So one of my cousins, my cousin Rachel, decided to throw I have 2 cousin Rachels now, actually, because I'm married oh, no. I have 3. I married into a cousin Rachel.

Jam:

Wow.

Melissa:

And then there's a cousin Rachel on my mom's side and my dad's side. Wow. Okay. So my Dad's side of the family cousin, Rachel, threw a family trivia night at a Mexican restaurant. Nice.

Melissa:

And it was really fun. It was me and my Dad, my brother, and Mason, and, Edison, my brother's son was there too. He was not really contributing to the team, honestly.

Jam:

Right.

Melissa:

But he was cute. Yeah. Comedic relief.

Jam:

There you go. And it

Melissa:

was really fun, and I thought we were gonna do pretty badly because I don't feel like I know a lot, and we would. Nice. All of our different strengths played out, so that was cool. Mason has watched a lot of Good Mythical Morning, so he knew The answer to the question of what the 1st fast food restaurant in the United States was.

Jam:

Woah. Interesting.

Melissa:

I know. My dad Knows a ton about sports. He knew one of the teams in the 1st football game ever played between 2 college teams in the United States.

Jam:

Interesting.

Melissa:

I know. Like, what an interest I'm like, oh, that is never even anything that I would have thought about.

Jam:

Yeah.

Melissa:

And he had that. Yeah. And I knew one about The Wizard of Oz.

Jam:

Nice.

Melissa:

The color of her shoes. In school, I learned that they changed it to ruby for the books, but it was silver or for the movies, but it's silver in the book.

Jam:

Oh, interesting.

Melissa:

These, like, random facts that each one of us had, we all got to contribute one of those. My brother knew about alcohol. A gin is made with,

Jam:

Juniper berries.

Melissa:

Yes. I never would have known that. Wow. You knew it off the top of your head. You could have come to our trivia team.

Jam:

I I know a lot of trivia

Melissa:

Really? I don't.

Jam:

Won't ever benefit me until I'm at a trivia night. I'm I live Hoping that the trivia night that comes up.

Melissa:

Well How I

Jam:

live my life.

Melissa:

Well, I'll go to trivia night with you. Our friend does one every Wednesday.

Jam:

Deal. I do love trivia. So

Melissa:

We used to do trivia at the movie theater. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Actually, one of the first times Mason and I ever hung out. It was with our small doing a trivia night.

Melissa:

That was really fun.

Jam:

That was my favorite because there's so many movie related things, which is definitely plays to my strengths. Yeah. Not all of the questions are, but a good amount of them end up being.

Melissa:

Yeah. That was really fun. Yeah. So my family won, and that didn't even matter because I had a great time.

Jam:

Nice.

Melissa:

It was really good. I have been stressed about Family get togethers around holidays, and so it being just kind of a random day in the middle of the summer, and there wasn't a lot of Stress going into it was really, really nice. So Yeah. Shout out to my cousin, Rachel, for facilitating that. I had a really, really fun time with All my extended family and being on a team with, you know, my immediate family, it was really a fun night.

Jam:

Dude, that's awesome. Very cool.

Melissa:

So thanks again, Rachel, for doing that, and thanks to all of you listeners for coming and letting me teach you about how And why ice floats in water and how that's kinda weird.

Jam:

And thank you for teaching us. And yesterday is kinda weird and very cool. And in fact, some might even say it's cold.

Melissa:

Oh, no.

Jam:

Yeah. Yeah. No. And so, If you have a question or idea about something that's chemistry related, in your everyday life, please reach out to us. You we love your ideas just like Wendy did.

Jam:

Reach out to us with this question. And so you can do that at Gmail, Twitter, Instagram, or Facebook atchem for your life. That's Kem, f o r, your life to share your thoughts and ideas. If you'd like to help us keep our show going and contribute to cover the cost of making it, go to kodashfi dotcom/chem for your life or tap the link in our show notes to donate the cost of a cup of coffee. If you're not able to donate, you can still help us by subscribing on your favorite podcast app and rating and writing review in Apple Podcasts.

Jam:

That also helps us share chemistry with even more people.

Melissa:

This episode of chemistry free life was created by Melissa Collini and Jam Robinson. References for this episode can be found in our show notes or on our website. Jam Robinson is our producer, and we like to give a special thanks to A Molina who reviewed this episode.

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