What is dietary fiber?
Hey. I'm Melissa.
Jam:I'm Jam.
Melissa:And I'm a chemist.
Jam:And I'm not.
Melissa:And welcome to chemistry for your life.
Jam:The podcast helps you understand the chemistry of your day life.
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Melissa:Alright.
Jam:Well, I'll take 4th possibility.
Melissa:That's nice. Okay. Well, before we get too far into today's episode, I do want to shout out Our new listener patron not new listener. I don't know how long this person's been listening, but our new Patreon supporter, Zan
Jam:p. Awesome. Suzanne, welcome. You've actually been on our, like, one of our patrons for about a month or so. We just had gotten ahead of recording, and so just now getting a chance to shout you out.
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Melissa:Yeah. Just to give a little insight, This is it's the end of June right now is how far ahead we are. So but I did reach out to Suzanne and let her know, oh, we might not be You might not get your episode very quickly, but it's not because we're not we're gonna do it the next time we record, but that's for a July episode. Yes. So, Okay.
Melissa:So, for the meat of today's episode, I'm Uh-huh. I'm doing a question that actually came from our listener, but also in real life friend and husband, Mason.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:So yesterday oh, go ahead.
Jam:My friend just for the people who could see gestures.
Melissa:Right.
Jam:My friend and also Melissa's friend, but then usually the first thing you'd lead would probably be, like, her husband. Yeah. Mhmm. And then her also her friend. Yes.
Melissa:The my marriage partner.
Jam:Yeah.
Melissa:Okay. So and Jam's business partner.
Jam:Yes. True.
Melissa:So yesterday, I was talking about fiber and, you know, daily dietary fiber because my stomach gets mad a lot, so I kinda had to be up to date with my fiber intake.
Jam:Uh-huh. Uh-huh.
Melissa:And He was like, but what is fiber? And I I knew that I had actually tried to get an answer to this before for an episode, and I eventually gave up. But I do want to know, and so I decided to pursue a new satisfying answer as to what is dietary fiber.
Jam:Okay. Interesting.
Melissa:Okay. So and, also, once I got into it, I realized why I gave up, and I'll flag that when we talk about it. Okay. So before I give you any chemistry lessons, what do you know about dietary fiber? And do you have any questions about dietary fiber?
Jam:Let's see if any questions come up as I just ramble. But, let's see. I know that dietary fiber, it's typically like, one of the best sorts of it sources of it is, you know, plants. That's what you always hear talked about. Mhmm.
Jam:Various vegetables and grains and other things that might have a good source of fiber in them. One of the things I remember hearing, which I hope this isn't too I don't know. I don't really know how to explain it other than this, but I remember hearing this. The big part of it is that because there's certain aspects of plants that we just don't have the ability to digest. Mhmm.
Jam:And that is sort of helps in our digestion move things through because it's not something that we need to break down or process. And that a lot of fiber is somewhere in that category. Mhmm. And but that some animals can Digest some of that stuff. It's like there's a difference between what humans and certain animals and insects, whatever else can can digest and and breakdown from plants that they eat.
Melissa:We got about half of that really close and right and half of it kind of wrong. Okay.
Jam:And I'm
Melissa:not gonna talk about, other animals at all. Okay. I didn't get into that. But half of that, you got really good, which is the definition that relates to how you, are able to digest fiber. The part that's a little bit more is how it helps things move through.
Melissa:You're completely wrong about it. But Yeah.
Jam:I was gonna say, I don't actually know anything about that part. I don't know why it would help. Like Yeah. Why that would be better? And other than just the fact that, like, it doesn't like, our bodies don't have to do anything.
Jam:Like, it's like, oh, Alright. Just move that on through. Let that keep going. But it doesn't actually make logical sense to me. Like, I don't
Melissa:that, I will answer for
Jam:you.
Melissa:Cool. So that's exciting.
Jam:Yeah. It's very cool.
Melissa:And some of it doesn't really do that, and some of it does. So we gotta talk about it.
Jam:Here's another question I have Okay. That might not come up. Why would it be good for someone who has a digestion problems depending what their problems are? Why would fiber be a good thing? Wouldn't it Potentially be possible you'd want less of it.
Melissa:Yes. There is, sort of a sweet spot of fiber where if you go too much, it might not be good.
Jam:Yeah.
Melissa:And, actually, I think there was kind of a scandal. I mean, it was like a very niche scandal. I, sort of listened to a podcast about this where someone made a diet based around fiber in it. There's allegations that it caused health issues because they had so much fiber in it.
Jam:Got it. Okay.
Melissa:So, but, yes, I agree. There is a sweet spot. So Here's why I gave up and why I didn't know what fiber was for a long time.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:So to directly quote a source from 2005, there is no globally agreed definition of dietary fiber.
Jam:Oh, okay. Yeah. I can see what you mean. I guess so. It'd be frustrating.
Melissa:Yeah. Problems with dietary fiber arise from the lack of a universally agreed and reliable method to quantify all the components of dietary fiber. So they went on to list some other issues with fiber in that article, but I did pull out something consistently from a lot of different sources that I think will be a valuable definition that we can use to talk about what dietary fiber is.
Jam:K.
Melissa:And that is Much like what you said, it is the edible part of a plant that is not digestible to us. Yeah. The human body doesn't have enzymes to digest it. Okay. However, it may be beneficial to bacteria in our intestines.
Melissa:It may undergo a like a fermentation, I guess, type of process.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:But not like a human body breakdown process. Right. One source that I read said that in 1981, over a 100 scientists took part in a discussion on the definition of dietary fiber and methods for its quantification. But up till 1999, the EU and other countries were still deciding about a good definition for it.
Jam:Mhmm.
Melissa:So it's been in a gray area, I feel like, for the long time. And before the eighties, It was sort of discounted as being valuable at all. Like, it sort of newly became something in the eighties that we realized had more valuable property. It became more of interest, I think.
Jam:Interesting.
Melissa:Yeah. It was just considered, you know, extra material from the plants, and we didn't really have to worry about it.
Jam:Yeah.
Melissa:So and this is kind of an aside. It's it's different than the definition we use, but I kind of wanna put out, an a help all to our biochemistry friends because there was a consistent chemistry definition that I was unsatisfied with, and that was called a non starch polysaccharide. So saccharide means sugar. Polysaccharide is lots of sugar, so a type of polymer. But the non starch, I could not clarify.
Melissa:It kinda took me down a rabbit hole that hold that I didn't feel was super helpful to our listeners, But about what defines a starch versus, or, like, a non starch versus a starch, I couldn't get a satisfying answer. So and I felt like, this isn't really useful to the episode. But if someone out there And that's I think I found that definition and had the same frustration last time. And, again, that's probably why I gave up. But if someone out there can give a succinct clear definition of that, that would be very helpful.
Melissa:But all that to say, I think the best definition for our purposes today is the edible part of the plant that is not digested, but may support bacteria in the intestines. Okay. So fiber is classified into 2 different kinds, Soluble and insoluble.
Jam:K.
Melissa:And solubility, this I guess we're not gonna have a traditional chemistry lesson, but we are gonna use chemistry concepts that you already know. Okay. So do you know what solubility is?
Jam:Solubility. And
Melissa:our listeners can pause and think as well. Oh, what is what is the definition of solubility?
Jam:Is solubility, like, dissolvable?
Melissa:Yeah. Mhmm.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:Yes. How much of something can dissolve, you know, is ability to dissolve in a liquid. Do you know why some things are more soluble than others?
Jam:So it this would refer to the thing that you're trying to dissolve. Correct? You would describe something as soluble
Melissa:Oh, yeah. Like, this is like, salt is soluble in water.
Jam:Yeah. Okay. So it's about the thing, not the Okay. Why is it gonna be more soluble?
Melissa:Mhmm. As a chemistry concept and maybe a good thing to think about is, when something dissolves in something else. It's not like that thing is breaking apart or anything. Essentially, the molecules of the liquid is called the solvent is surrounding the thing that's being dissolved.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:So something that's more soluble more of that can be dissipated in the liquid. Something that's less soluble, less of that will be dissipated in the liquid.
Jam:Yeah. Okay. Do you
Melissa:want me to give it to you?
Jam:I guess with, like, The structure of how the the size of the molecules and their ability to maybe, like, Be able to not break apart, but, like, distribute. So it's like it's obviously still there's still little pieces of salt
Melissa:Like particle size.
Jam:Particles, but they can do that they can actually come apart without without the salt itself coming apart, if that makes sense.
Melissa:Well, salt's kind of a specific case where it actually does come apart because it's an ionic compound, so it can separate. But I think maybe a better way to think about it is what thing have we learned about where we talk about how a molecule interacts with other molecules.
Jam:Oh, intermolecular forces. Yeah. Okay.
Melissa:So solubility is about how well can this molecule be surrounded by other molecules.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:So particle size and it still being even called a particle, that's more suspension.
Jam:Mhmm.
Melissa:And, like, I think that's a little bit more in, too far area of chemistry. So bring it back into more basic chemistry. Intermolecular forces is like an individual atom being surrounded by water, for example.
Jam:And would that in and end up end up including, in some cases, like, Polarity or nonpolarity?
Melissa:Yes.
Jam:That's something wouldn't wanna dissolve if it's you're trying to put it in something very different from itself.
Melissa:Yes. So I think salt does not dissolve as well in oil is a dozen water. As my guess based on intermolecular forces. So it is all about intermolecular forces, but, so That's your little solubility reminder.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:Generally, in chemistry, it's about how well can something dissolve in something else.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:Typically, it's about intermolecular forces. Sometimes, there's some really very big, long thing that has a hard time dissolving in water, particle size would come in play or whatever, but we're not talking about that. K. In dietary fiber, soluble and insoluble fiber is actually only referring to water. Okay.
Melissa:So there is types of fiber that can dissolve in water, and then there there are types of water that can dissolve in water. What? There are types of fiber that can dissolve in water, and there are types of fiber that cannot dissolve in water. Okay. So the kind that dissolves in water, we'd call that soluble fiber.
Melissa:The kind that doesn't is insoluble fiber. So it's not soluble in everything or not soluble in everything, it's specifically water in this case.
Jam:Right. And I guess that makes sense too because you you probably would have a hard time Categorize them in that broadly if it could be soluble or insoluble in anything. Yeah. Like, if you say, this is insoluble. Like, oh, have you tested everything?
Melissa:In what? Period. Insolvable. Period. Yeah.
Melissa:Yes. So there's those 2 kinds. And insoluble fiber that doesn't dissolve in water, it it actually though can attract water.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:So that's, something sometimes called hygroscopic or sometimes you would say hydrophilic, like it's water loving. So it can attract water, but it's not gonna break down in water. So it sort of is able to It's attracting water can attract water to your stool.
Jam:Mhmm.
Melissa:And it sort sort of can help bulk up your, fecal matter and the softer, larger fecal matter can pass faster through your intestine.
Jam:That's exactly how MiraLAX works.
Melissa:I don't know if it's insoluble or soluble, though, because doesn't it dissolve in water?
Jam:Well, I don't know, but This is based on just the the way that my wife dumbed down the explanation for me is that it draws water into
Melissa:Into your
Jam:stool. Yes.
Melissa:Okay. I was thinking oh, I might have been thinking of Metamucil, which is the fiber supplement. You're talking MiraLAX is a stool softener.
Jam:Yes.
Melissa:Yes.
Jam:So it does the same thing, which is which makes sense. It's like, if you don't have if you're having some problems and you it's kinda too late or, like, I guess you could eat some fiber or you could drink some stuff or whatever. But you do sort of dissolve it. But who knows if actually really dissolve or if it just Yeah. Distributes itself in the water?
Melissa:Yeah. I've wondered about that with Metamucil. I don't know what kind of fiber it is. I probably should've looked it up before this episode, but what can you do? Yeah.
Melissa:I 2020.
Jam:So funny because I didn't think about that being the same way that, like, just fiber implants would work.
Melissa:Yeah.
Jam:And that then making something like MiraLAX, Would be like, oh, we wanna mimic the thing that's already happening Mhmm. But just make it be a a sort of, like, faster, quicker
Melissa:Instantaneous.
Jam:Yeah. And maybe more maybe a lot more in intense than, like, fiber would be.
Melissa:Yeah.
Jam:Maybe it's like this is like eating, like, 30 carrots
Melissa:Very good. You're just only taking the fiber out
Jam:of it.
Melissa:Yeah. I would now I am interested to see how stool softeners work, so I can maybe put that in my brain. So that's insoluble fiber, though. So insoluble fiber does exactly what you said at the top of the show. You're like, insoluble fiber, It is, not digestible by our body.
Melissa:It bulks up our stool. It softens our stool by attracting water, and it sort of passes out.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:Okay. The but the part where I was like, oh, you're wrong about this part is insoluble fiber kind of does the opposite. Okay. Or soluble fiber. Sorry.
Jam:Okay. Wait. Insoluble does what you said. Yep. Soluble
Melissa:Sort of does the opposite.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:Soluble fiber, it does dissolve in water, and it actually can make you feel full by slowing down how quickly food leaves stomach.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:And by how quickly some things are absorbed into the bloodstream. So a big one for that is glucose. Okay. So glucose can be really rapidly absorbed in the bloodstream if it's not consumed with fiber, but if it or specifically soluble fiber. But if it is consumed with that kind of fiber, it can slow down that process making you feel fuller for longer, getting a longer energy hit, you know, instead of just, like, really quick, we're gonna get a boost energy, and then we're gonna, you know, get tired.
Melissa:If you have your soluble fiber with that sugar intake, it can your energy and give you energy over a long period of time instead of fast and quick.
Jam:Interesting.
Melissa:So that kind of virus sort of slows down digestion.
Jam:And it and it I guess I'm guessing that's a really good thing as long as there's not, like, a ton of that only.
Melissa:I think a ton of both is bad.
Jam:K. Got it.
Melissa:Think it's good to get both.
Jam:Right. Right. Okay. You wouldn't want anything going way too slow or way too fast.
Melissa:Yeah. Yeah. And what's weird is it seems like dietary fiber does not clarify which one is which. And I think that could be because Both of them occur
Jam:Right.
Melissa:In plants often.
Jam:That's funny though because, like, then then when you're saying dietary fiber, if you're talking about both, you're you're which makes sense because they're both in our diets. They're both things that are in what we could eat. But you're not talking about one thing. It's sort of like you're talking about Yin and yang. You know?
Melissa:Yeah. Exactly. They, like, sort of go together.
Jam:Yeah.
Melissa:So I think that's been part of why it's hard to give it a formal definition to dietary fiber Because there are these 2 different sort of classes of molecules that one does one thing, the other does the other thing, but they sort of appear in nature together. Mhmm. So some examples of insoluble fiber is, lignin, which we talked about in the vanilla So do you remember?
Jam:Yes. CCS. I was like, where did I hear that? Yes.
Melissa:And then we also, have talked about cellulose before, but not extensively.
Jam:Mhmm.
Melissa:Often found in plant walls. Lignin also often found in plant walls. And then also lignin acts as a It, like, does the rigidity in wood. It's a big thing that lignin does. And what's cool about lignin is it has parts of it that repel water, so it actually helps in the vascular system of plants, water move through it, but it also has parts that attract water, which is how it attracts water in our gut.
Jam:Got it. Got it.
Melissa:So that's cool. Some common example well, the most common example, the only hard and fast one that I can find of soluble fiber is pectin. Okay. And we've talked about pectin before. Do you remember when?
Jam:Man, I wouldn't have gotten lignin. It would take me forever. Mhmm. So you you said it so quickly then. I was like, oh, yeah.
Jam:That all sounds right. Pectin. Pectin.
Melissa:Our listeners are gonna know about the pectin because they're going to have listened to this in the rerelease, that we're gonna we're recording out of order.
Jam:Got it. Okay.
Melissa:On purpose so that we could have this moment. Do you want me to lay it on you?
Jam:Is there any hint you can give me, or is it just gonna be 2?
Melissa:Bakers probably know this.
Jam:Bakers.
Melissa:Especially, like, Great British Bake Off style, like, hardcore bakers that make every element of their cakes or other. Maybe homemakers also.
Jam:Does this go is this back to the baking powder baking soda
Melissa:stuff? No.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:Wonder if I can how could I I don't know how to narrow it down without it was just telling you, so I'm just gonna tell you.
Jam:Just tell me.
Melissa:It's the thing that gives jams and jellies its structure.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:And so that's how I imagine. I don't know if it's accurate, but that's how I imagine soluble fiber in our bodies. It just, like, is able to be dissolved in water and make a gel.
Jam:Okay. Okay. Yes. Okay. Got it.
Melissa:And chia seeds have a lot of fiber. Theirs is primarily insoluble fiber, but I've wondered if that gel that forms would be a form of soluble from Chia seeds. Interesting. Because that's sort of how pectin feels. You can buy pectin.
Jam:As a yeah. It's come back to me. I remember you saying that you can buy it
Melissa:Mhmm.
Jam:And mix it in and and make stuff with it or whatever.
Melissa:And, usually, industries produce it, like, from you know, if you peel an orange and you have that white part Uh-huh. If they make orange juice, they'll take that part and get pectin out of it. Or for, apple juice, they take the leftover pressed apples and isolate pectin from that. So they're using every part of the fruit.
Jam:Interesting.
Melissa:Isn't that cool?
Jam:Yeah. That's super cool. Also, wow. I don't there's so much about that episode I probably don't remember. It'll be very interesting to listen back to it.
Jam:Yeah. It was like, That was how long ago was that? Or did you happen to look
Melissa:at it? Early 2021. March 2021. So that's more like two and a half years, basically.
Jam:Yeah. Wow. Yeah.
Melissa:We've been doing this podcast for a long time, which sometimes I forget.
Jam:Yep. Yep.
Melissa:Because It doesn't
Jam:always feel like it. That's for sure.
Melissa:So that that's the most common one, pectin.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:There recently, there was a push to get something called acacia gum or Arabic gum Mhmm. Because it is also the the same kind of thing. It's a soluble dietary fiber, so people petition to have the FDA add it, and they did. And I think that was in 2016. 18.
Melissa:Interesting. So it says gums and gels in the soluble fiber, but pectin was, like, the only solid thing that I could consistently pull out.
Jam:Okay. Got it.
Melissa:So, that's essentially dietary fiber, but all those things that I just referenced, examples of both soluble and insoluble fiber, have something in common at the molecular level. I'm quizzing you a lot because these are all old lessons that come up a lot. So Okay. There's cellulose, lignin, and pectin are some that I gave you.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:They all have something in common at the molecular level. Can you make a guess about what that might be? You don't have to. I could just tell you. I believe you know it.
Jam:All of those have something similar at the molecular level Mhmm. That makes them and those are all in the soluble?
Melissa:No. Soluble and insoluble have something in common.
Jam:Oh, that's me.
Melissa:Cellulose cellulose and lignin are insoluble, and then pectin is soluble.
Jam:Okay. Now something in common. They all went to the same school.
Melissa:Kinda. Okay. I'll tell you.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:They're all polymers.
Jam:Oh, man. I should've just gone for it. That's like one of those where, like, I could if I wasn't trying to get it right, and I was just going based off of, like, how many times have this thing come up in our podcast? Yeah. I probably could could could go with, like, is it a polymer?
Jam:Or is it intermaced or force?
Melissa:I know.
Jam:I know. And not try to think too hard. That's the problem. It's like when you think too hard and You want to get it right. You aren't guessing obvious things because I wasn't sure.
Jam:I had no reason to believe that they were Other than just that comes up in our podcast a lot and because of maybe if I listen to those episodes, it would be, like, you know, very obvious.
Melissa:Oh, yeah. I don't know if we hit on the fact that lignin is a poly polymer, but cellulose, definitely. Okay. And lignin and cellulose together are the number 1 and number 2. Cellulosa, number 1.
Melissa:Lignin, number 2, most common organic, polymer. And they contribute I think I was listening to a podcast about lignin, and it said 30% of biomass from lignin. And that's second to cellulose, which makes me think cellulose produces 30 plus percent of biomass. So those 2 make up 60% of the biomass. S.
Jam:Wow. Dang. I
Melissa:know. Isn't that wild?
Jam:That's crazy.
Melissa:There's a lot of other really interesting stuff about lignin that I wish I could give you all the fun facts about it. I think that that is from an episode of chemistry world, podcast, which is from the Royal Society of Chemistry, and it's, It, it does, like, short episodes about different molecules, and some of them, I think, are kind of beyond our ability to process unless you're, like, a chemist in the field. But I think the lignin one would be interesting to a lot of people. So it'll be linked.
Jam:Nice.
Melissa:But so cellulose and lignin both are in cell walls, and pectin is in and around cells, like between cells in plants and in cells in plants. Okay. So there's all kinds of of fiber in these plants.
Jam:Wow.
Melissa:And that's something when we talk about getting a low carb diet, technically, these are carbohydrates. So they you wanna make sure that when you're, you know, putting some kind of dietary restriction with the guidance of a doctor, You are still getting fiber because it can be really beneficial. So that's essentially, dietary fiber. It's polymers that are from plants that are edible, but they aren't broken down really in our digestive system. And so they either speed up digestion in our bowels, or they slow absorption of glucose into our bloodstream.
Melissa:Dang. Dang. There you go. Wow. Do you wanna try to take a stab at explaining that back to me?
Melissa:I mean, it was kind of a weird one where we just had chemistry lessons aside.
Jam:Mhmm. Yeah. I yes. I will. I'll I'll I feel like a a analogy was On the tip of my tongue, sort of.
Jam:Like, I was starting to almost get 1 piece together, and then it started slipping away from me a little bit. 8. Sometimes you start thinking of an analogy, and then you realize quickly, like, oh, but then it doesn't quite go the as far as you want it to. You know? You're like, oh, wait.
Jam:It really kinda works early, and it seems really promising, and then you kinda get further in your head, and you're like, oh, wait. I don't know if that works. But here here's what I was thinking of. And then we you usually, when I write up an analogy, even if it's, like, only half okay Mhmm. Usually, you can think of modifications to it that make it more.
Melissa:That's true. Yeah. So We can work together.
Jam:Yes. Work together. So first, I was thinking classic situation, classic, analogy for digestion would be like roads and traffic. Right? And there's things moving.
Jam:Regardless of what we're eating, we are having to eat, And there are things needing to use these roadways to get through or whatever. And so the 2 different types of fiber, you could probably imagine them being different types of vehicles maybe or like that.
Melissa:So This is exciting. I I don't know where you're going with this, and I'm like, oh, this is gonna be so good. 8
Jam:Easier the easiest one would be, say, like, the soluble fiber that slows things down. You 8. You could probably pick either. They're like a, a street no. It's not that one.
Jam:They'll they're they're like, they're like semitrucks Where
Melissa:Okay.
Jam:They're there. They're moving, but they're gonna slow things down inherently. If you More and more you add, they're gonna slow things down, but they're not they're not trying to. Their whole goal isn't, like, stopping everything.
Melissa:Yeah.
Jam:But traffic is going to slow down just by their presence once you have enough of them there.
Melissa:The thing I like about that is they're also helping deliver nutrients.
Jam:Right. Right.
Melissa:And so it's kind of slowing and helping the nutrients be more sustainable. Yeah. So that's good because that's what semi trucks do. They move food around a lot of times.
Jam:Then here's the hard thing. This is a tough one. And I think maybe if you've experienced this when you're Driving, like, on a highway, then you'll know what I'm saying. But it's not like a common everyday thing.
Melissa:Okay.
Jam:But I I have been on roads before. Usually, if it's up I'm, like, on a long drive somewhere. Like, when we go to Indiana to see my wife's family. You can sometimes find a situation where there's a group of people We're deciding to go fasten the speed limit in a lane, but they kind of band together. Mhmm.
Jam:So you get 1 car, 1 brave individual Who's like, yes, maybe there are cops ahead. I'm gonna be a safe driver. I'm gonna go 567 over. Mhmm. Hang out in left lane.
Jam:Who's with me? And once that happens, though, then the flow of traffic can kind of go that way with people who are willing to go fast also. So that would be like the insoluble where it's like bringing things with it Mhmm. To move things more quickly. Those things in the case of the the addition will be water drawing water into our stool so that it, can can be sort of softened and and fuller and passed through more quickly.
Melissa:Yes.
Jam:But in the Travis situation that I've experienced it, which has just not been a ton of times when it works. It's great though because
Melissa:Yeah.
Jam:Then everyone's like, yep. We're good. And if someone's gonna get pulled over, It'll be 1 of us at random, but at least none of us are alone in this.
Melissa:There's 1 quarter chance or whatever.
Jam:Yes. And I think I think what's good about that, if it works right, is that Faster traffic is drawn to and moving on one side and, and but the flow of all traffic is benefited From that Yeah. If done correctly, and if no one's being reckless and dumb and selfish. Yeah. Those that's the closest I could come up with.
Melissa:I like that one. I thought you were maybe gonna say, like, oh, inside fiber is like a bus where it just gets more people at once to where it needs
Jam:to go. Nice.
Melissa:It's, like, bigger and bulkier.
Jam:That's good.
Melissa:But then there's not the equivalent of that for for the insoluble fiber that's, like, except the sim. So I think that's good.
Jam:Yeah.
Melissa:I like that analogy. That's really good.
Jam:I'm on my way there. I'm gonna stop I'm gonna stop motorcycles because they can move between things, but that wouldn't help other cars.
Melissa:Oh, I just thought of another one.
Jam:Oh, yeah.
Melissa:What if it was like, a cleaning situation? So you have a house cleaner that comes in once a week or once a month, and they do a quick clean of everything and everything's cleaned up. Yes. And that's great. And then but you should also have an organization system, and that slows things from from getting crazy in the 1st place.
Jam:Yes. Yes.
Melissa:So it's like it's like mess. We've got mess, and that's what our digested system is transporting.
Jam:Mhmm.
Melissa:So the organization systems, the soluble fiber keeps things from getting crazy too quickly
Jam:Mhmm. And
Melissa:then a cleaning crew that comes in and does, like, a quick clean and then moves on is, like, the insoluble.
Jam:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's good.
Melissa:Hopefully, that will be helpful to people. Yeah. But I thought that was interesting. And now you know at the molecular level, They're just all basically polymers that we can't break down.
Jam:Interesting.
Melissa:Wow. Plants make. Thanks, plants.
Jam:Yeah. That's crazy.
Melissa:And what's crazy is at a basic level, all of our food is just the sun turned energy. I mean, that's the food chain. But Yeah. Plants take energy from the sun and make food to sustain everything that's alive on the earth.
Jam:Wow.
Melissa:Maybe not insects, but I think even insects. Yeah. Yeah. Wild. Right?
Melissa:Yep. Kind of cool. Okay. So you've earned yourself a fun fact.
Jam:Okay. A lot
Melissa:of fun facts. Lot of fun facts. I strongly encourage you to go listen to that episode about lignin because I was like, woah. On chemistry world, it's like 5 minutes. Both forms of dietary fiber can prevent lung cancer, or they they can help fight against it.
Melissa:The language is vague. Here's how, though.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:Insoluble fiber, because the larger softer stool moves through your intestine faster. If there's anything carcinogenic causing cancer in your stool, it's your colon is exposed to that for less time.
Jam:K.
Melissa:So that's insoluble fiber.
Jam:Okay.
Melissa:Soluble fiber does something that we didn't talk about, but it can It it can bind to, acid. So bile acid are released into the intestines to help with fat digestion.
Jam:Mhmm.
Melissa:And those can turn into possibly carcinogenic things in the intestine. So our body can even turn our own stuff from our own body into carcinogenic things, which is crazy.
Jam:That is crazy.
Melissa:I know.
Jam:This is one of the things where, like, when people you know how people will be like, Yeah. I had a scare of this sort of of this kind, so I started, like, eating healthier and blah blah blah blah. And and then there's people who have theories about, like, that they'll kinda just say, like, eating healthier is just gonna prevent blah blah blah, all this stuff. But then you learn chemistry the the actual details of stuff where obviously, this doesn't help protect you from every kind of cancer ever, But it's like, okay. Here's a little secret built in nature thing
Melissa:Yeah.
Jam:That if we were to eat more dietary fiber would help at least decrease these chances here
Melissa:Yeah.
Jam:Of getting this specific kind of cancer.
Melissa:I know.
Jam:But sometimes I think the average person is just like, you know, Eat healthier, less chance of cancer. It's like, they over we over took a while.
Melissa:The specific of how. Yeah. Also, probably eating less fats It's because the bile acid are are released into the intestine to help fat digestion.
Jam:Mhmm.
Melissa:So maybe not less fats, but, like, healthier fats that are easier for our body to digest would mean less bile, but it's like both of those Yeah. Are good. Maybe you're eating too much fat and not enough fiber, that's, like, a not good combo. I'm not a doctor nor a registered dietitian, so don't this is just me based on the chemistry. Yeah.
Melissa:The FDA does recommend 25 to 30 grams of fiber a day. K. And the average European and American get roughly half of that or less. Oh, no. It's like 15 ish.
Jam:Dang. I wonder how much I get.
Melissa:So I oftentimes log my food because I was trying to figure out why my stomach was always mad.
Jam:Mhmm.
Melissa:And I, nowadays usually get above 20.
Jam:Nice.
Melissa:And a big part of that is smoothies with chia seeds. And A trick I learned from a really cool registered dietitian on TikTok Uh-huh. Is, she cuts up yellow squash and freezes it and uses that as a base for smoothies instead of ice.
Jam:Oh, nice.
Melissa:And so for, like, an easy breakfast, she'll just do those smoothies and a protein drink
Jam:Uh-huh.
Melissa:And blend it up. Wow. But I do it with chia seeds and then, like, protein powder or something Yeah. And then almond milk. So that is a good way that I get fiber, but also I pretty much exclusively eat lentil pasta now, which is not as good as other kinds of pasta, but it does have a noticeable impact on my digestion.
Melissa:Yeah. Yeah. So that's a little bit about fiber.
Jam:Wow.
Melissa:Does that make you really wonder? You're like, should I log my food and see how much fiber I get?
Jam:Yeah. And I have logged food off and on before for different reasons. Mhmm. And When I get in the habit, it's actually really nice. You're just aware of what you're eating.
Jam:And regardless of what your goals are, it's it makes you very aware of that, which is really cool. But I've never actually looked at any of the Trends other than calorie related goals, I've never looked at other trends like, I love the fiber What's looking
Melissa:at that stuff.
Jam:Yeah. Yeah. I've never done that.
Melissa:It's so satisfying. There's lots of links to, like, fiber and, colon reduction, and then there's stuff about protein and weight loss. And it's really interesting to to have, like I love data. You know? So I'm like, I get data on my own body.
Melissa:I love that.
Jam:Yeah. I do like I do like data. I I guess part of it's because I it's hard to hard enough to do it in the 1st place, and it's not as interesting to me as other data that I've seen or Yeah. You know? But I probably if I had problems I need to deal with, which could easily happen, then I'd care a lot.
Melissa:Yeah.
Jam:I'd be looking for whatever thing might be hold the key. You know? Yeah. Which is exactly what you've been doing. You'd be like, Which of these things might actually matter Yeah.
Jam:To make a difference?
Melissa:I do think having a good mixture of the, like, insoluble, insoluble fibers helps because Before I think, I just got a lot of, like, you know, like, salad, like Yeah. Celery, that kind of stuff. I feel like that that wasn't as good as some of the things. But Yeah. Who knows?
Melissa:I'm not a dietitian. I will say, though,
Jam:not eat food every day, though.
Melissa:Not encouraging you to log calories if you have an unhealthy relationship food or anything. But for me, that was interesting to see how much just how much fiber did I usually get. Yeah. And then how can I increase this in relatively easy ways, like swapping out regular pasta for lentil pasta
Jam:Mhmm?
Melissa:Has a really positive impact on my digestion. You know? So in all of our pasta meals that we make, that's what we
Jam:Yeah.
Melissa:Usually use. So, yeah, that's something interesting maybe our listeners could do.
Jam:And you even telling us what the average, like, American and European has in their in their diet is helpful to know if it's like okay. You could could log it, or you could probably just guess that you're probably under what they recommended and just increase it.
Melissa:And see how you could increase it.
Jam:Yeah. Yeah. Probably most of us could do that without really actually checking how much we have knowing the product is probably gonna be good for us.
Melissa:And it's a good source of fiber like whole grains, beans, which I looked up what kind of soluble fiber was in beans also picked in in that. But yeah. So beans, whole grains, fruits, veggies, those are your
Jam:Dang. Cool.
Melissa:Those are your main sources. And there's a lot of good information on extension websites. So those are the websites that, they're people who specifically try to go between scientists and the public and make information more available.
Jam:Mhmm.
Melissa:And I've linked those As I always link our, sources in the show notes.
Jam:Yeah. Sweet.
Melissa:So, normally, I would finish up with a happy thing for this week, but we also talked about our fiber for a little while. So what do you think? Quick quick happy thing and then wrap it up?
Jam:Let's do a quick one. Yep.
Melissa:Okay. You can go first.
Jam:Okay. My quick one is that I, just in the past couple weeks, Took me a little longer than usual to do this, but finally got back into my cold brew system.
Melissa:Nice. Okay. I was wondering what your cold brew system is. If you could quickly give it to me.
Jam:I can quickly give it to you. Not not an endorsement, but I use the Toddy Cold brew system. Mhmm. Benefit, paper filter, and felt filter. 2 filters.
Jam:Neither of them metal. Cleans out all the silt and all that kind of stuff, which is And I do a 6 to 1 ratio. So 6 parts Water to 1 part coffee. I was like, wait. Oh, I was like, where else do I say that wrong?
Melissa:Okay. I'm seeing 6 to 1.
Jam:Be very hard if you did it the other way around. And that makes it a concentrate?
Melissa:Okay. Yes. I was wondering how to make a concentrate.
Jam:Yes. So I do I do 6 to 1, and then it makes it concentrated enough where I think I've played with it enough where I think you're getting as much of the coffee dissolved as you can. If you go more concentrated, I don't know that you can actually get more. You know? Okay.
Melissa:Yeah.
Jam:But you're leaving some there undissolved Yeah. Which you're means you're wasting some. So 6 to 1, and then whenever I pour it, after I've I I brew it for 16 hours. And after it's done, when I pour some into a glass myself, I do, equal parts of the concentrate and water. Nice.
Jam:Yeah. But that's been really fun. I hadn't I like to do it every time it gets hot, but it just took me a while back in that groove and be like, oh, I need to make some cold brew and make some some cold brew. Finally did it, and I'm loving being back in the cold brew zone. It's like just a fun seasonal Coffee change for someone for coffee and you're like me.
Melissa:So Sort of like the switch into fall, but for coffee.
Jam:Yep. Exactly.
Melissa:I have, for some reason, been enjoying cold brew lately, and I don't know why because I don't usually I had gotten to where I basically never drink coffee anymore. But Yeah. When Mason would come home for roasting, he'd smell like coffee, and I was like, that smells good. Yeah. It kinda got in my head, I think.
Jam:Yeah. And he could do I don't know if he told you this, but I I Intentionally use some decaffeinated coffee. Mhmm. Though it's just not quite as, like, intense caffeine because it's The numbers people have different ways of caffeine, but there's it's a lot more caffeine usually.
Melissa:Cold brew? That's good to know.
Jam:So we we've done that, and it doesn't affect the flavor too much. And so I I yeah. I like using a little bit of decaf. So you
Melissa:might could do that. People say that decaf coffee is gross. And to learn more of that. Go listen to our episode.
Jam:About decaffeinated coffee. Yeah.
Melissa:Yeah. That's cool. Okay. So I am for my happy thing this week, I was gonna talk about, resting. So Yeah.
Melissa:Our church right now is doing a series on rest and, like, how important it is to rest. And So we've been, taking, like, days of rest intentionally on the weekends. And as someone whose schedule is so crazy, it is really wonderful. And so, what kind of, I think Emily called it a day with no have to's or shoulds. Like, a day where you don't have to do anything, and you don't feel like you should do something.
Melissa:You can just do the things that, you know, bring you joy and that you delight in and Use that to rejuvenate your system going forward, and it's been really, really nice. So
Jam:Nice.
Melissa:I wanted to tell our listeners to try it. Yeah. Just take a day, be off your phone, or be off social media. You know? So, like, texting my friends makes me happy sometimes.
Melissa:So but I'm like, social media scrolling ultimately does not usually make me feel good. Like, I learn things on it. So sometimes that's good, like the dietitian that check that I told you about. But Yeah. But not it's usually not for the best.
Melissa:So
Jam:Totally.
Melissa:I've really enjoyed doing that. It's just taking, like, a, like, an unplugged day where we'd also we try to minimize plans. Like, there are some Saturdays where there's stuff, like, every hour planned out. Mhmm. And it's been really nice to have no things planned.
Melissa:Like, we can wake up and say, let's go for a walk. You know?
Jam:Yeah. It's
Melissa:like There's things we know we want to do, but we don't have to do it at any time.
Jam:Yeah. Totally.
Melissa:So that's been really nice.
Jam:Yeah. That's super nice.
Melissa:That's what we do vacation too. It's like, There's things we wanna do, but mostly we don't have a plan.
Jam:Yeah. Don't have a too detailed itinerary. Yeah. Yeah. Totally.
Melissa:So, yeah, that's been really nice, and I really minute. That's my happy thing.
Jam:That's awesome.
Melissa:Well, and I think Josh had a lot to do. Oh, I said Josh. I think jam had a lot to do with, that being involved in our, church. So thanks for that, and thanks for being excited about fiber also.
Jam:Anytime. Thanks for teaching me and and to kind of, yeah, delving into something I'd really Only just heard something about, but never really looked into it all.
Melissa:Yeah.
Jam:So very cool and very everyday.
Melissa:And cool that there's not a ton of like, oh, there's not a ton of solid information. So it's helpful to have time to process through it.
Jam:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And, like, most of us hear about that kind of stuff is, like, part of the truth, maybe just a sliver of it, and also has probably a lot of other that that's not true or at least Not the full picture.
Melissa:Yeah. So,
Jam:the classic stuff for, like, yeah, diet related things. So, anyway, Thanks for teaching us, and Wilson have a lot of ideas for topics of chemistry in everyday life, but we wanna hear questions from you, ideas from you, just like this one came from Mason. So your life.com to share your thoughts and ideas. If you'd like to help us keep our show going, contribute to cover the cost of making it, go to patreondot com/chem for your life or to the link in our show notes or the show description to join our super cool community patients like patrons like Suzanne did. And if you're not able to do that, you can still help us by subscribing on your favorite podcast app, subscribing on on YouTube as well, and then rating and writing our review on for our podcast on Apple Podcasts.
Jam:That also helps us to share chemistry with even more people.
Melissa:That really does help us to share chemistry with even more people, and we're starting to do shout outs to some of our reviews in our bonus episodes, so check that out as well. Mhmm. This episode of Chemistry Free Life was created by Melissa Collini and Jam Robinson. Jam Robinson is our producer, And this episode was made possible by our financial supporters on Patreon, including our new supporter, Suzanne p, who this episode was dedicated to. It means so much to us that you wanna help make chemistry accessible to even more people and that you've we've helped us reach over a 1000000 downloads is so exciting.
Melissa:Those supporters are Abishai B, Brie M, Brian K, Chris and Claire S, Chelsea B, Derek L, Emerson W, Hunter R, Jacob T, Christina g, Lynn s, Melissa p, Nicole c, Nelly s, Steven b, Shadow, Suzanne p, Timothy p, and Venus r. Thank you all again for everything you do to make chemistry for your life happen.
Jam:Something. And if you like to learn more about chemistry lesson. Check out the references for this episode in our show notes and in the description of the video. And yay chemistry.
Melissa:Yay chemistry.
